THE HON ANDREW HASTIE MP

SHADOW MINISTER FOR INDUSTRY AND SOVEREIGN CAPABILITY
FEDERAL MEMBER FOR CANNING

TRANSCRIPT

INTERVIEW WITH CHRIS SMITH, 2SM

Tuesday 19 May 2026

Topics: Budget; Labor’s death tax; Giggle v Tickle; immigration; Victoria Barracks.

E&OE……………………………………

CHRIS SMITH: Andrew, welcome to the program.

ANDREW HASTIE: Good morning, Chris. Good to be with you and your listeners.

CHRIS SMITH: Thank you. Good to have your company. Well, what a wild week that was last week. I know this Budget has been contrasted with other Budgets, and how bad it has been. I cannot remember – and I was just saying this to Joe Hildebrand last hour – I cannot remember still talking about a Budget seven days later and still reporting on new members or new sectors of the community who are complaining about aspects of it. This was an absolute stinker.

ANDREW HASTIE: It was an absolute stinker, Chris, and it's a war on aspiration. What's worse, it's a Budget of broken promises, higher taxes, more debt, lower living standards, and fewer homes for Australians. The really sad part of it all is that we've got a Prime Minister who's incapable of telling the truth, because the changes that he and Jim Chalmers are bringing in were changes they explicitly ruled out before the last election. And within a year they've broken their promise, they've told a lie, and they're ramming home changes that the Australian people didn't vote for.

CHRIS SMITH: It's similar to what Julia Gillard did with the carbon tax, and I said at the time that she has to have the guts to take the carbon tax to an election. You can't tell us you're not going to bring it in, take advantage of that, be elected, and then bring it in. It's as low as it goes, and is it any wonder that we have less and less respect for politicians?

ANDREW HASTIE: Exactly. Bill Shorten's, former chief of staff, Cam Milner, is writing in The Nightly newspaper. He said that they thought with a massive majority in the lower house, with the Opposition sort of going through a process of restoration – they thought they could pull the wool over the eyes of the Australian people. Well, the Australian people aren't mugs, particularly when they get their calculators out and they start looking at the hit to their family budgets, or their businesses, or their trusts, or wherever it is that Labor is lining up for more taxation.

CHRIS SMITH: The idea of any kind of death tax in the Budget was not listed in the documents. We don't see a column that says death tax introduced, or how much that death tax is. But I don't care what they say to defend it. The changes that they've made to these family trusts, that to me is a classic death tax, because it robs our next generation of young people – who they claim they're trying to help – but robs them of getting access to their parents' wealth.

ANDREW HASTIE: Exactly, it doesn't say death tax, but it's very clear what they're proposing. If your listeners go to Budget paper two, page 22, it's right there – discretionary testamentary trusts will be affected. So just the process of someone dying and their estate is passed on to their loved ones, or those in the will, by the executor – that will immediately trigger a 30 per cent tax on that wealth. It's a death tax – there's no other way to put it. It's as simple as that.

CHRIS SMITH: I want to talk to you about the Tickle v Giggle court case finding out of the Federal Court on Friday. I spoke with Sally Grover yesterday, and she is livid that we've still got the situation in this country that we don't know, under law, the difference between a female and a male. This has to be cleaned up. Thankfully, I noticed that your leader, Angus Taylor, said that if the Coalition does get back into power, he would change the law. It's got to be cleared up, because the way it is now interpreted by the courts, Andrew, is just nonsensical. Most Australians – 90 per cent of Australians – would look at it and say, that is palpably unfair to women everywhere.

ANDREW HASTIE: It is, and we're going to stand for women, because we're a party that believes in common sense. Angus Taylor grew up on a farm – he knows the difference between a male and a female, because how else do you breed livestock? When it comes to defining a woman, it's pretty clear what a woman is but unfortunately, we're now in a place where people in this country are in intellectual freefall – particularly those ones in positions of power. What the Australian people really need is clear leadership that's rooted in reality and common sense, and that's why we'll be amending the Sex Discrimination Act to ensure that women and girls have protections based on their biological sex.

CHRIS SMITH: It's crazy stuff. And there are comments coming from other parts of the world in the last 24 hours saying that we've got it so wrong in Australia and I think that's fair commentary. As a matter of fact, one of those was Kellie-Jay Keen, who was here in Australia a couple of years back. She was basically advocating for women's rights - the right to be safe in private spaces, in particular, which under this law means that they cannot be safe. This is what she had to say over the weekend.

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CHRIS SMITH: I don't know why it's taken this long for the penny to drop. The penny won't drop in terms of government MPs, they won't want to talk about this, because they'd be embarrassed that such a decision would be handed down. But I think the political class has kept right away from this, for fear of upsetting a minority group.

ANDREW HASTIE: That's right. It's ideological in the end, but these are people who are more committed to ideology than they are the basic reality that we can all see and observe, that we all know exists throughout the natural world. One of those key parts of reality is that there is a distinction between males and females – it's just practical stuff. There's a proliferation of unisex toilets across the country now. I've got two little girls; I have to go into the toilet with them now every time because I don't know who's going to be on the other side of the door. And so, there's all these practical consequences which this radical ideology is baking into our infrastructure as well. That's why it's so important to get the basics right, which is why a Coalition government under Angus Taylor – a man of common sense – will amend the Sex Discrimination Act to ensure that women and girls have protections based on their biological sex.

CHRIS SMITH: I want to mention something to you about the wholesale sell-off of army barracks around Australia, in particular the Victoria Barracks here in Sydney, which you are very au fait with. We've had another major former ADF soldier say today, and quoted in some of our papers, saying that this cannot happen. It's well and good during a non-conflict process or a non-conflict era to say: we can make a lot of money with those barracks, because there's nothing going on at the moment. But that just means that we're not prepared when the time comes, doesn't it?

ANDREW HASTIE: Exactly right. One of the things that a lot of Australians don't realise is that when World War One started, we were one of the most urbanised countries in the world. We have this myth of the bush soldier, but most of the first AIF were drawn from our cities. Our cities still remain our main population centres, and so we've got to have an ADF presence in our cities for Reserves, of course, but also for the existing Defence capabilities that live in our cities. If we sell these bases off, where are we going to put them? We further dislocate Defence from the Australian population, which makes recruitment difficult, and we just put them out of sight and out of mind, and I think that's a real tragedy. I also think that for the serving men and women, having that continuity and that connection with their history is so important. It goes to esprit de corps, fighting morale – all those things that are so important in our ADF. You can have the best guns, you can have the best equipment, but if you don't have ticker, if you don't have heart, you're not going to be effective on the on the battlefield. One of the ways you generate that ticker and that heart is linking those in the present to the past, and that's that great spirit of Anzac, which is reflected in our buildings, our architecture and our history.

CHRIS SMITH: It's interesting. Ken Gillespie, the former Chief of Army – retired Lieutenant General – he was quoted in the Telegraph today saying: if I was in the position of Premier Chris Minns, I'd be asking the Prime Minister and the Defence Minister how they intend to handle the security implications for issues that might arise in Sydney, and its effect on the people of this city. In terms of a terror attack, for instance – a prolonged terror attack, or an attack on the city – it would be a location like the Victoria Barracks which would play a major role, would it not?

ANDREW HASTIE: It would. Ken Gillespie, a great Australian with lots of experience, is absolutely right. If we had to stage a counter-terror force drawn from the Second Commando Regiment in Sydney, for example, Victoria Barracks would be a perfect place to do it, with all their vehicles, their kit, their equipment – all the supporting assets. This is why you need a presence within the city. And frankly, if we want to rejuvenate our Reserves, which are neglected at the moment under this Labor government, we're going to need infrastructure in our cities. Again, Victoria Barracks in Melbourne, Sydney, and other facilities around the country are so important to that Reserve work.

CHRIS SMITH: Very true. Now, in some ways, I would say that Andrew Hastie has dragged his party into the common sentiment of most of Australians in terms of immigration, and they came kicking and screaming. They even changed leaders as a result of that process. You were one of the first to say: mass immigration is out of control; we're getting people into the country that aren't suited to the country as well. The party wouldn't shift too quickly. Sussan Ley left the party, and then we had Angus Taylor. They've finally caught up with you, Andrew.

ANDREW HASTIE: That's right. That's why I resigned back in October, because I didn't think I was being heard, and I went to the backbench for a couple of months, and here we are. Angus Taylor has shown courage in coming up with a pretty radical policy, which I think will impact a lot of young Australians, and will give them hope of owning a home again by pegging the net overseas migration figure every year to the amount of housing completions. The amount of houses should we build one year – that'll be the amount of people we let in. Because here's a really interesting statistic for your listeners: our population over the last four years has grown by 1.8 million – 400,000 of that 1.8 million has been through births. The rest has been through migration – 1.4 million people – and we've only built 500,000 homes. So all those 400,000 kids that have been born here, they're all obviously going to be housed by their parents, but we've got to find houses for all these people coming from offshore, and we're just not building enough. That's why we've got to peg it to housing completions.

CHRIS SMITH: Exactly. It's a little bit like a stadium – you're not going to put 50,000 or 70,000 people into Subiaco stadium in WA when there are only 40,000 seats. You've got to create the seats before you invite the people.

ANDREW HASTIE: Well, that's why we knocked down Subiaco Oval and moved to Optus Stadium! You're absolutely right, and that's why we're also committing $5 billion to help get the roads, the utilities, the sewerage built, and we're going to accelerate the build of 400,000 new homes. It's really important, Chris. The left want to say it's about race, and they want to say it's about prejudice – it's basic economics. If the numbers don't stack up, they don't stack up. And right now, we're letting too many people in, we're not building enough homes, so we can't house Australians already living here, and we can't house people migrating to Australia, and that's an unacceptable situation.

CHRIS SMITH: Exactly. Listen, question with that notice. I had a discussion on the show yesterday with listeners about Anthony Albanese's idea of reinventing or rebirthing the car industry. You were one of the first to say this last year, and I remember commenting on air, saying: how is that going to work? We got rid of it for the reasons of inefficiency. How would Andrew Hastie bring back the car industry? Are you still supportive of that idea?

ANDREW HASTIE: I have a local friend here who owns a bunch of Fords – about 10 of them – and I wanted to show to the Australian people that we used to make stuff of value, and I wanted to really cut to the heart and demonstrate what we are capable of when we are productive. I want to have an advanced manufacturing capability in this country. Whether we make cars is beside the point – I just want to be able to make things of value, because Australians are at their best when they're producing, not just consuming. If we're ever going to make stuff again, we need to kill Net Zero, we need to use our coal, our gas, we need to get the nuclear ban lifted, and we need to get cheap, abundant power across this country to power industry and power business.

CHRIS SMITH: Yeah, get rid of Net Zero, get uranium unbanned, and maybe we can get ahead. I appreciate your time this morning, Andrew Hastie. Thank you very much.

ANDREW HASTIE: Always a pleasure, Chris. Thanks for having me on.

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